This coming Wednesday at the Ideas Cafe, we will discuss spying and whether states should be spying on their allies.
We discuss spying before at a previous cafe. For sovereign states dealing with each other with no binding world court and rule of law to force judgment on rogue states, it is the rule of the jungle in play.
We may depend on moral persuasion, trade sanctions, and exclusion from the rest of the world community, but ultimately, we cannot cross sovereignty borders to punish other states while expecting others to respect our sovereignty.
Outright war or invasion becomes the only option left.
But there is no monarch for the whole world that individual states have to listen to.
Whether it is watching North Korea's nuclear weapon ambitions, Iran's death threats to Israel, Russia's and China's level of military prowess. Monitoring other states becomes a necessity.
But what about allies?
Do treaties pledging allegiance mean anything?
Can we trust common interests to ensure predictable response from our allies?
Do allies stay allies forever through changes in government and democratic changes?
"Trust but monitor" - is that really trust?
Perhaps trust is more than a black and white issue.
Apart from those we trust and those we don't, there is a wide spectrum in between with varying shades of grey.
There is also the consequential consideration of what misjudging our trust can cost us. National security, trade secrets, politically sensitive information are very high stakes compared to whether someone is going to pay their rent this month.
Monitoring and spying cost resources as well as implications to the very element of trust itself.
The recent news of the US listening to the German Canceller's mobile phone calls was big news. But are we sure that the Germans are not doing the same but not caught?
privacy is incredible important and can also result in oppression and violence in relationships where there's a great power in-balance. I think there comes a point where I can knock on my neighbour's door and say, "hey I heard you shouting at your kids again and its bothering me" But who knows if they'll listen, especially if I'm not friendly with them. Also, preaching how people ought to live goes against freedom of choice. Some cultures are consistently arbitrary and believe this is the best way to rule as people can decide to live as they chose. That seems ridiculous to me!
ReplyDeleteMovements are made up by consciousness and I believe that the personal is political. While I really need my privacy there is a stronger need to have my space respected in a civil state. My territory is my own business but if its intruded upon by persons with more power than myself than who can I turn to for assistance? My neighbour? That's why I think its good to get to know your neighbours. And while most people don't want to hear this I think that spying is a good thing. But its not enough. Discussion about people's conduct has to go along with spying. Otherwise its better to leave everything to a self policed and gunned non state one world nation. Not exactly my idea of freedom or a civilized world either.
But I must confess I don't really know my neighbours except for the loud ones down the hall. And there's not anyone to report the noise to.
Best to move to Switzerland and eat lots of chocolate!
to do onto others as they would to you, applies in the question of rulers and spying too. Often people are placed in situations where they have little power or control and this is when they precisely deserve and require assistance. Social contracts, spy's or a counsel do not hinder the weak by allowing them to be spied on without providing transparency of the counsel too. At least that's my understanding of Hobbs, but I am limited in my readings, I realize.---in any civilized society if a person is harmed by military or spy wear they should be able to chose their own compensation, not have it demanded upon them. What could possible compensate having one's privacy invaded? I suppose a person would like to have what was taken from them back, and then some.
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